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You take a –2 item penalty to attack rolls with an improvised weapon. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts, a trait that gives +2 to hit with all improvised weapons. Note that, for comfort and ease of use, most kitchen items are lighter weight, and smaller than, a short sword which would suggest most kitchen items are two or more size categories smaller than the wielder (they're smaller than an item in that size category). I support a limited subset of Pathfinder's rules content. As in, if he frequently makes use of frying pans, barbeque skewers, knives, cutting boards, pots/cauldrons, spatulas, ladles, and measuring cups, those would all work fine, but showing up at a kitchen with tools hes never used, or rarely used, he will not be able to use them with Finesse Training, because he is unfamiliar with them. According to Weapons it is whenever, you the GM, decide you want it to be: It is next to impossible for any game to cover every conceivable weapon from all cultures, eras, works of fiction, and players’ imaginations. In the final days of Pathfinder 1E, they finally fixed this oversight by introducing new feats to cover that oversight. He asked if he could use Shikigami feats, as improvised weapons didn't have much going for them in normal core pathfinder, and I didn't see a problem with it, at first. Which with Shikigami puts them up to about Greatsword damage. See, improvised weapons have a -4 penalty, because they aren't proper weapons, but, on top of that, no one is proficient with them either. Id also say that if you are referring to the little guide to improvised weapons from Adventurer's Armory 2, there is a category of "Light" improvised weapons that includes, for example, a crossbow bolt, a kitchen knife, a rolling pin, or a human skull. 10ft throwing range, takes a standard action if it doesn't have the thrown quality and a FULL-ROUND ACTION if he throws a 2 handed weapon. If you want to increase your character’s defense beyond the protection your armor provides, they can use a shield. The improvised weapon has a critical threat range of 19–20, with a critical multiplier of ×2. His post-buff AC is enough to usually avoid being harmed by most of the enemies in Burnt Offerings (so far), though I’ll see about adding in some swarm enemies. So, an improvised light or one-handed melee weapon can be thrown as a standard action (meaning you can take a move action), while an improvised two-handed melee weapon can be thrown as a full-round action. Only exceptions are items which explicitly state they act as other weapons, like the sledge which always acts like an improvised earthbreaker for 2d6. Not normally the biggest of deals, but warpriests are all about utilizing action economy and need swift actions especially, so that slows their buffing by a round. Benefit: You do not suffer any penalties for using an improvised ranged weapon.You receive a +1 circumstance bonus on attack rolls made with thrown splash weapons. A merciful metamagic rod is 1,500g, that's a +4 weapon in the hands of a shikigami user. Orange: OK options, or useful options that only apply in rare circumstances 3. When using an item for anything other than its intended purpose—such as using a crowbar as a grappling hook or an old shirt to bandage a deadly wound—reduce the improvisation penalty by 2. In many cases, new weapons can be represented as slightly different versions of existing weapons, such as a Chinese dao that uses the shortsword rules. Using a wire to grapple like this requires the character to make an attack roll as if using unarmed strike, but with a -4 penalty for using an improvised weapon without the normal penalties associated with using it as a ranged weapon (see Special). The number of Design Points a weapon receives is determined by whether it is simple (4 DP), martial (5 DP), or exotic (6 DP). Arrows: An arrow used as a melee weapon is treated as a light improvised weapon (–4 penalty on attack rolls) and deals damage as a dagger of its size (critical multiplier ×2). Weapon focus doesn't apply, but they did print a feat to fill that specific gap for improvised weapons. Damage wise it may be broken, balance wise it shouldn't be - so what if he walks up and squishes the goblin in 1 hit.. the difference between the 2d6+4 and a greatsword is nothing except the improvised needed to spend 3 feats to get there. His character really likes croquet, and would use his croquet mallet when possible. Because such objects are not designed for this use, any creature that uses an improvised weapon in combat is considered to be nonproficient with it and takes a … More action economy. They've selected "cooking gear" as the target for their Finesse Training, which is kind of broad, but so far it hasn't been an issue. In general, a light weapon is an object two size categories smaller than the wielder, a one-handed weapon is an object one size category smaller than the wielder, and a two-handed weapon is an object of the same size category as the wielder. When I kept breaking the improvised weapons, my logic being using something not meant for combat will likely easily break it, and that improvised means he isn't meant to just keep using the same thing, he started saying he'd start using a steel dowel rod. Benefit: You do not suffer any penalties for using an improvised weapon. Are Improvised Weapons considered a type of weapon as a group? You have an uncanny knack for turning equipment to new and unexpected uses. Armor increases your character’s defenses, but some medium or heavy armor can hamper movement. Although it seems unlikely that an Improvised Weapon can be used with Weapon Finesse, if it could be, what does that mean for the UC Rogue's Finesse Training? The GM determines the amount and type of damage the attack deals, if any, as well as any weapon traits the improvised weapon should have. Possibly even only allow the tools he cooks with regularly, but not other cooking tools. Give it the Fragile weapon property. They have thrown a chair once and hit someone with a table leg once, they're now level 13. Brawler/Titan Fighter/Goliath Druid with a large sledge. the build you wrote down doesn't seem to add up. As long as the item matches to that of a light weapon, then it should work for Weapon Finease. I know you can't normally put weapon enhancements and special qualities on a non-weapon, which means you can't get flaming on a bar stool. I do think that its a bit much to break improvised weapons just because they do damage, as even weapons with the Fragile quality only break on a nat1. Additionally, whenever you gain a class feature that grants you expert or greater proficiency with any weapon, you … Unarmed opponents are flat-footed against any attacks you make with an improvised melee weapon. This warpiest with no buff is attacking at +9 for d10+5 (avg 10.5) or +8 for d10+7 (avg 12.5) compared to your +6 for 2d8+4 (avg 13). ... You take a -2 item penalty to attack rolls with an improvised weapon. Archetype Weapon Improviser Prerequisites trained in all martial weapons You don't take the normal –2 penalty to attack rolls with improvised weapons. I had no problem with it, thought it would be neat. Personally, as a GM, I'd allow "Improvised Weapons" to be the weapon category of Weapon Finesse because of your own arguments about lack of upgrades. I would be annoyed as a player if the GM started to break my weapons. Agree here, and above post. Improvised weapons used to be pretty terrible, so they had to make strong things to make up for it like a trait that gives +2 to hit with all improvised weapons, comparable to a fighter's greater weapon focus that they alone can take at 8th level. Additionally, whenever you gain a class feature that grants you expert or greater proficiency with any weapon, you also gain that proficiency with improvised weapons. Page 278: Under Improvised Weapons, add the sentence “Improvised weapons are simple weapons.” This dictates the proficiency modifier you use. A roll of a natural 1 on an attack gives it the broken condition. To be honest though, I could easily see myself allowing 'cooking gear's to apply, as you have, but then restrict other improvised weapons from working. Because such objects are not designed for this use, any Creature that uses an improvised weapon in Combat is considered to be nonproficient with it and takes a –4 Penalty … I think as long as the improvised weapon is a light weapon finesse should work fine. A +5 weapon dealing 6d6 damage for pittance. Add a few extra mooks to each fight. This means you take an additional -4 penalty for not being proficient with the weapons. Finesse Training: due to the mercurial nature of improvised weapons, in my opinion, Finesse Training would require the Rogue to select a specific improvised weapon to apply to. Thrown weapons, esp improvised ones have some really harsh rules. Wielding a table leg as a weapon is similar to a club. Improvised Weapon Mastery (Combat) Source PRPG Core Rulebook pg. So even with those feats, you still take a -4 penalty for not being proficient. You don't take the normal –2 penalty to attack rolls with improvised weapons. No comment on their editing. I hadn’t just realized at the time how absurd Shikigami could be until he started pumping out his damage. Benefit: You do not suffer any penalties for using an improvised ranged weapon. Mentioning this because it is an often overlooked rule. Normal: You take a –4 penalty on attack rolls made with an improvised weapon. This means that wielding a sledgehammer will not work with Weapon Finesse as it is a two-handed weapon. To get a str damage of +4 on a 2 handed, that requires a str mod of +3. G… If you would like help with Pathfinder player options not covered here, please email meand I am happy to provide additional assistance. You said level 3, so bab 2, lets assume 18 str as its not really min/max'd at that, and for feats Weapon Focus, Possessed Hand, Power Attack and wields a MW bastard sword + shield. She takes a –4 penalty on the combat maneuver check, and she can’t attempt an improvised maneuver check more than once per round. In session two into the adventure path, they'd bought themselves a travelers any tool and by 5th level shikigami manipulation, had a +2 two-handed weapon for 250g that can do any type of physical damage they want (bludgeoning, slashing or piercing). Foes are surprised by your skilled use of unorthodox and improvised weapons. Increase the amount of damage dealt by the improvised weapon by one step (for example, 1d4 becomes 1d6) to a maximum of 1d8 (2d6 if the improvised weapon is two-handed). Last night we had what I would consider to be the funniest game sessions I've ever ran. Table: Starting Character Wealth lists the starting gold piece values by class. Because such objects are not designed for this use, any creature that uses an improvised weapon in combat is considered to be nonproficient with it and takes a –4 penalty on attack rolls made with that object. I know you can't normally put weapon enhancements and special qualities on a non-weapon, which means you can't get flaming on a bar stool, Not related to your question, but if your player wants stuff like that, the same companion book gave us these gloves. You take a –2 item penalty to attack rolls with an improvised weapon. Lets not forget casters either... A tree, a chunk of steel, or more specifically a sledge (called out as being 2d6 as an improvised earth breaker) are all valid. What is too often is of course a slider depending on who you ask. Just as a side note, if you want to see Shikigami Style get abused, you can forget about the obvious stuff. Arrows come in a leather quiver that holds 20 arrows. Sometimes objects not crafted to be weapons nonetheless see use in combat. At level 3 he'd have a BAB of +2. You can turn nearly any object into a deadly weapon, from a razor-sharp chair leg to a sack of flour. So it's not you as the DM arbitrarily saying 'oh bummer your weapon fell apart right now because I feel like it', but is an independent external cause. As in, anything he works with regularly as he cooks is fair game, but he won't be able to use, say, a blacksmith hammer in conjunction with Finesse Training. It simplifies determining what damage objects do. not RAW, but using Elephant in the Room feat tax rules, WF applies to a selected Fighter weapon group, One thing I've wondered is: "To what extend does an Improvised Weapon qualify as an actual Weapon?". They are level 5 now and I don't intend on changing the rules to completely destroy their character, but I am seeking some clarification if things have been set up correctly. This means you take an additional -4 penalty for not being proficient with the weapons. I actually am playing a shikigami style warpriest in my Wrath of the Righteous campaign and I'm the heavy hitter of the party. If he rolls another 1 on an attack roll before it gets repaired then it gets destroyed and he has to buy a new one. Instead, a weapon’s size category is keyed to the size of the intended wielder. I'm not the first to say it, and I'm pretty confident I won't be the last; The Shikigami chain of feats was a mistake. So, not that bad. Now, they're significantly stronger than any other melee build. Its about as bad as a Fighter or a Barbarian using a greatsword honestly. You are used to throwing things you have on hand. According to Weapon Size, again in Weapons, the handedness of a weapon is based entirely on the weapon's size and any special traits that bypass size restrictions from the above creating new weapons. As a warpriest, he is very combat focused and yet still has only a 3/4th BAB. If it misses... well, that's it. The dowel rod he had in mind was he’d order one large enough to be considered as a 2h medium weapon, so 1d10 bumped up to 2d8. Breaking on their own would suck. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, More posts from the Pathfinder_RPG community, For info, news, resources, and anything else about the Pathfinder TTRPG! Find the answers to the most frequently asked Pathfinder questions, along with rules changes to keep your Pathfinder game on the cutting edge! You don't normally find a ton of cooking equipment laying about anyway. Playing a variation of this buid myself, I can highlight some main weaknesses: Ranged attacks. 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